Compilation | Wu Talks about Blockchain
In this episode, Donald Trump, along with his sons Don Jr. and Eric Trump, and partners Steve Wickoff and Zachary Folkman, discuss the launch of their new cryptocurrency platform World Liberty Financial (WLFI). The conversation delves into the challenges facing entrepreneurs in the crypto space, the role of decentralized finance (DeFi), and Trump's personal experience in the crypto industry, including NFTs. The discussion also highlights how the platform is committed to democratizing opportunities for wealth creation and providing financial solutions to underbanked populations.
What is your vision for the future of cryptocurrencies? Why hasn’t the U.S. become a leader in crypto?
Donald Trump: I think it will be the leader very quickly. But we have a very hostile regulatory environment right now, like the SEC. I have a very different attitude, if we don't act quickly, China will take the lead. And the total market value of the crypto industry is huge, it's larger than the market value of many large companies combined. We have to be the largest market, because if we don't, someone else will take that position.
When we look at the crypto market, it's still young, but it's very strong. If we don't act, countries like China will seize the opportunity, and many countries want to take advantage of this space. We have an advantage because it's us (the United States). But our greater advantage is me, because I believe in the crypto industry. Many of my friends and my children are very interested in cryptocurrencies. For example, Baron is very familiar with these things. He often talks about his crypto wallets. He has four wallets. I asked him, "What is a wallet? Explain it to me." But he knows all about these things. And the same is true for Eric and Donald Jr., who understand cryptocurrencies very thoroughly, even more deeply than many older people. I admire their judgment very much, and they always show excellent insights. I believe that cryptocurrencies have a very special prospect, and although it is huge now, it is still a nascent industry compared to the future. I think it will develop even better in the future.
What impact did learning about cryptocurrency from your children have on your thinking?
Host: I love that you mentioned your kids, who are also using crypto wallets. I’m teaching my mom how to use a wallet myself, and I give her some ETH every Christmas and her birthday. My little brother is also a member of Gen Z, and although he may not be as old as my mom, he is also learning these things. What impact has learning about cryptocurrencies from your kids had on your thinking?
Donald Trump: It really made it easier for me to understand cryptocurrency. It's like learning a new language. My granddaughter Arabella speaks fluent Chinese, and both of my grandsons learned Chinese at a very young age. They learned it very quickly. If you want to learn a skill, it's best to start at a young age. The same is true for cryptocurrency. For me, my children understood how cryptocurrency worked early on, which made me realize how important it is.
Why do you think the U.S. must lead in cryptocurrency adoption and innovation?
Host: I just came back from Asia, where I attended Korea Blockchain Week and Webex in Japan. There, cryptocurrency is no longer a trend of the future, but a reality that is happening now. When I go back to Canada or North America, it always feels like there is a lag here. So I wanted to ask, why do you think the United States must take the lead in cryptocurrency adoption and innovation?
Donald Trump: This is not just about cryptocurrency, it's also about artificial intelligence (AI). We need a massive power infrastructure, much larger than what we have now. The United States needs to move faster in these areas, or we will be left behind. China has already begun building a lot of power facilities, primarily to support AI development. They don't have to go through complex environmental impact assessments, and we have a lot of restrictions in this regard. I will accelerate this process and ensure that the United States can quickly increase its power supply to support these emerging areas.
Whether it's cryptocurrency or AI, we have to stay ahead of the curve in these emerging technologies. If we want to continue to be a great nation, we have to be at the forefront. We've made great achievements in space, like the Space Force. Before, China and Russia were ahead of us in space, but now we are the world leader. I'm very proud of that. Elon Musk has done a great job, launching 90% of the world's rockets. We have to continue to stay ahead, whether it's cryptocurrency, AI, or other emerging technologies.
Do you think the United States should develop an appropriate legal framework to support the development of crypto businesses domestically?
Moderator: Many American crypto entrepreneurs have had to leave the country because they find it too difficult to develop in the United States. My company has also experienced being refused service by banks, and even had its account closed. Do you think the United States should develop an appropriate legal framework to support the development of crypto companies in the country?
Donald Trump: I think there should be some regulation, although it may not be what everyone likes to hear, but some degree of protection is necessary. The current environment is very hostile, and the SEC (U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission) has been very harsh on the crypto industry. I believe that since they knew I was involved, the situation has improved. Maybe they realized that this market is very large and has great potential, so they have restrained themselves. If we don't win this election, the situation may be much worse. The election results will directly affect the future direction of regulation. We must stay ahead of the curve, whether it is chips, AI, or cryptocurrencies, these are what we must do.
Can you tell us about the success of your NFT and whether it came as a surprise to you?
Host: Now let's switch to a lighter topic. I remember when your NFT series was released, there was a lot of hype. On our morning show, FOMO Hour, a lot of people rushed to buy your NFTs, and even interrupted the show to buy them. I remember everyone was frantically buying NFTs, but they sold out very quickly. Can you tell us about the success of this NFT? Did it surprise you?
Donald Trump: Honestly, I thought the NFT market had cooled down, it was hot a few years ago. But when I decided to launch NFTs, I thought, ‘Why not give it a try?’ Surprisingly, we launched 45,000 NFTs, and we thought it might take six months or even a year to sell out, but it sold out almost on the first day. We launched several more NFT series later, and the market response was very good. People loved buying them, and most of the transactions were completed in cryptocurrency, which made me realize the importance of cryptocurrency.
Moderator: I'm glad you can share these experiences with us in person. It's comforting for many people working in this industry to hear your views on cryptocurrency. We will be watching the results of the November election.
Does NFT give you a new perspective on digital assets?
Host: Last question, does NFT give you a new perspective on digital assets?
Donald Trump: Maybe NFTs changed my mind because most people bought these NFTs with cryptocurrency. If they used US dollars, I might not feel much. But the proportion of using cryptocurrency is very large, which really made me start to think about the potential of this emerging field. My children also opened my eyes, and many smart friends around me believe in cryptocurrency, so this has a great impact on me.
Moderator: Thank you so much for sharing this, Mr. President. I'll be with Steve Wickoff and some of the other guests in a minute. But thank you so much for your time, Mr. President. I'm really touched that you're doing this interview the day after the second assassination attempt. It's an honor for me, a 30-year-old kid from Montreal, to be doing this interview with you. Thank you for the opportunity.
Donald Trump: Thank you. It's been a great conversation.
Do you think DeFi can change the wealth creation model in the United States?
Host: Do you think this approach can change the wealth creation model in the United States?
Steve Wyckoff: I think decentralized finance is the future. If you want to borrow money, you have to be a recognized member of the "privileged class". When I first left the law profession and started working on behalf of the president, I wanted to go into business, but it was hard to get credit. And credit is what drives us forward.
Steve Wyckoff: Cryptocurrency makes this possible. Decentralized crypto applications make this possible. So we want to help the unbanked, or the people who don't have access to banking services at all. They don't have a bank that's willing to listen to them. So we see a huge opportunity to democratize this process, to equalize it, and we can benefit from it at the same time because there are a large number of people who can't get credit in the current system. This is not normal, especially for young people who have great ideas, but they can't realize those ideas. This is not the American dream.
Moderator: Thank you very much, Mr. Wyckoff, for sharing these insights with us today. We really appreciate it. Next, we will continue with Donald Jr.'s thoughts.
(Host chatting with Donald Jr.)
How does decentralized finance (DeFi) solve these real-world financial problems?
Host: Oh my goodness, that's so true. Okay, let's get back to the point, Donald Jr., you talked about the system that no longer works for many Americans, and this is a theme you've mentioned often. Mr. Wyckoff talked about this, and your father and your family have been talking about this. I want to share my experience of my company and my CEO's account being "debanked". My CEO is a US citizen in Texas, and he received a call from the bank and was told to come and collect his money. This is very familiar to you, and you and your family have been through similar situations. So how does decentralized finance (DeFi) solve these problems?
Donald Jr.: Yes, I think I may be a little slow to accept these technologies because I originally worked in traditional real estate, which was completely in the real economy. There was a time when we in the Trump family could just pick up the phone, call the CEO of any bank, and get a loan for any project at a low loan-to-value ratio and on very good terms. However, when we enter the political realm, these conveniences are suddenly cut off. It's not because we don't have a strong balance sheet, it's because the politics have changed. I've even been in a situation similar to what you mentioned, where I ran a business with a partner, and he called me one morning and said we had no money in our operating account, and he thought we had been hacked. Our account at the time was with PNC Bank, a large bank, and the account was operating perfectly normally, but the bank suddenly kicked us out of the system without notifying us.
I have a family member who had a seven-figure account, but when she tried to withdraw some of it to buy a house, the bank refused to lend her money. She had more money in her account than the house was worth, but the bank still deemed the loan too "risky." Clearly, this is all about politics.
We were the “elite” in the eyes of the banks, and overnight we were completely eliminated. This made us understand the plight of many ordinary Americans. In the United States, the founders set up a fair system, and decentralized finance is the embodiment of this fairness, rather than a system where middlemen extract a lot of valueless fees. The current system is not only inefficient, but also politicized. We feel this deeply, and the impact of all this can only go in one direction.
I've been called an "extremist" and other similar names, and I've gotten used to it. In fact, I studied finance at Wharton, and my family has changed the New York City skyline and done similar work in cities around the world. But even with this background, I still face discrimination from banks. For us, this situation has changed our view of the system. We want to build a truly fair system that no longer favors certain people for political reasons.
How can DeFi help ordinary Americans?
Moderator: I was going to ask, do you think the U.S. banking system has become politicized? Obviously, you've already given your answer. So, since this affects every ordinary American, how can DeFi help them?
Donald Jr.: DeFi eliminates this politicization. You can see that many leaders in Silicon Valley, who used to be long-term Democratic donors, have changed their positions because they understand that the Democratic Party is not willing to give up control of everyone's finances. Cryptocurrency poses a threat to their political power, and they don't want people to have real financial freedom. This freedom threatens their power, so they try to over-regulate the industry. They have made it clear that they want to increase regulation, but over-regulation will stifle innovation in the entire industry.
In the past, we were able to call any bank to solve the problem, but now the situation is completely different. Ordinary people do not have this power and do not have the corresponding resources to deal with this situation. The advantage of decentralized finance is that it is a correction to the unfairness of the existing system. Many people are systematically excluded because they do not have a family background like us. DeFi provides them with a fair opportunity.
What would you say to someone who is considering joining your camp because of cryptocurrency?
Moderator: There are many people in the crypto community who may not have supported your father before, but as time goes by, especially seeing his open attitude towards technology and innovation, many people are changing their positions. What would you like to say to those who were not in your camp before, but now consider joining because of cryptocurrency?
Donald Jr.: Actually, the answer is very simple, and the real data speaks for itself. If you look at it purely from a political perspective, the conservative camp is clearly more in favor of financial freedom. The Democratic camp is on the side of censorship, and they want to control everything through excessive regulation. At present, their intention to over-regulate cryptocurrencies is already clear. My father has already made his position clear during his first presidency, and he cut a lot of red tape and reduced unnecessary regulation. Everyone wants some basic regulatory framework, but we don't want excessive regulation to stifle innovation. If there is too much regulation, it will not be much different from the current traditional system, just in a digital coat.
Any framework will help, and we do need some regulatory framework. We work with some of the top lawyers in the world, and they are very well versed in the regulations, but even so, there are still many times when we face uncertainty. Sometimes different lawyers give different interpretations, and it is not their fault, but because the existing legal framework is not clear enough.
What is your opinion on the on-chainization of real-world assets and DeFi’s handling of mortgage issues?
Moderator: Speaking of frameworks and regulation, your father, as a real estate tycoon, has a huge influence in both Florida and New York, and is now very interested in the field of decentralized finance. He just mentioned the influence of you and your brother on him. Zach, can you tell us how you think about putting real-world assets (such as real estate) on the chain? What are the advantages of decentralized finance when dealing with issues such as mortgages?
Zachary Folkman: This is a great question. There are many things to talk about. I will highlight some of the key points. The first is transparency. Blockchain technology can record every transaction in an immutable ledger. I think the best example of this is the bond market, especially mortgage-backed securities (MBS). Before the 2008 financial crisis, many banks packaged junk bonds into AAA-rated bonds. Investors didn't know what they were buying because it was very difficult to track these assets. Only a few smart people like Michael Burry and John Paulson were able to discover the tricks and profit from them. Ordinary investors suffered heavy losses. If we apply blockchain technology to the bond market, this kind of opaque operation will no longer happen because blockchain can clearly record the origin and changes of these bonds.
Zachary Folkman: Another key point related to decentralized finance is the automation of smart contracts. We have all applied for a mortgage, and Donald and his family have gone through this process. Even in the past when loans were not too difficult to obtain, the entire process was very long and complicated.
Donald Jr.: It was true. Even when loans were not difficult to obtain, the process was extremely cumbersome. And the people involved were not necessarily very professional, but they charged high fees throughout the process, pushed some meaningless paperwork, and wasted time and resources. Not only were they inefficient, but they also caused a lot of unnecessary costs.
Zachary Folkman: Just like we need to make government more efficient, the business sector also needs to operate more efficiently because a lot of money is being wasted. Decentralized finance can greatly reduce these intermediaries through automation of smart contracts, thereby reducing costs. Another thing that excites me is that it provides opportunities for the younger generation to enter the real estate field. Many young people say to me, "Zach, how can I get into the real estate market?" I can only smile bitterly because generally speaking, only the top families have the opportunity to enter the high-end real estate market. But blockchain technology and tokenization can change this. Through tokenization, real estate assets can be divided into small pieces, allowing ordinary investors to participate, and this method can also attract global investors to the real estate market.
Zachary Folkman: Not only does this approach reduce costs, it also has the potential to increase the liquidity of assets, thereby increasing the value of real estate. I think this is very exciting.
