视频来源：《Exclusive with Delphi Digital’s Anil Lulla: Research, Crypto, AI, and the Future of Investing!》
Guest: Anil Lulla, CEO of Delphi Digital
Moderator: Jagdish; Sushil Sanghvi, Cryptography Researcher
Compiled & edited by TechFlow
Background Information
In this special episode, we sit down with Anil Lulla, Co-Founder of Delphi Digital, one of the most respected research and investment firms in crypto. Anil shares his remarkable journey from Wall Street to building a $500M crypto powerhouse. We dive into Delphi’s unique research process, the future of crypto AI, how to navigate complex market cycles, and why Anil is more bullish on crypto than ever. He also reveals the top projects he’s watching and has a huge giveaway for our listeners. Don’t miss this exclusive conversation with one of the top minds in the space!
From Wall Street to Crypto
Anil Lulla shared his experience of transitioning from the traditional financial world to the crypto space. He mentioned that he had been passionate about business and technology since he was a child, and his father foresaw that he would not work for others.
While studying finance, Anil developed an interest in using mathematics to predict business changes.
Challenges and opportunities of entrepreneurship
Anil recalls his experience with his team trying to raise $20 million to start a venture capital fund in 2019. Despite facing rejection from investors, they stuck to their beliefs and started the fund by using a credit card with a 0% APR. Eventually, they successfully scaled the fund to $500-600 million, forming an internal family office model without interference from external investors.
Investor Regrets
When talking about the relationship with the investor, Anil mentioned that although he had never met the investor who rejected them, they had communicated with each other. The investor said that this was the biggest mistake of his life.
Anil’s experience highlights the importance of perseverance in the face of adversity and how to find opportunity in adversity.
Secrets: How Delphi predicts crypto trends in advance
Advantages of Delphi Research
Anil said Delphi’s research team is excellent and is able to identify potential opportunities in crypto trends before they are widely discussed.
Anil emphasized that when they recruit team members, they prioritize those who are passionate and curious about the crypto space and create ideal roles for them so that they can play freely.
Core principles of research
Anil mentioned that the Delphi research team follows two main principles. First, the team always believes that "if it appears on crypto Twitter, it's too late." This means that they strive to find trends that have not been widely discussed so that they can make investment decisions before others. Second, they require each report to be in-depth and unique, ensuring that what is written is not mentioned by other sources. This approach gives Delphi's reports an advantage in both information density and uniqueness.
Personal reading habits
Anil also mentioned that he does not know the specific content of the research before it is released, and he will download and read the report as soon as it is released, especially when flying. He believes that this continuous learning and research allows him to keep up with the latest developments in the encryption field.
Crypto and AI: Why Delphi is betting big on this space
Delphi's investment in crypto AI
Anil Lulla talked about Delphi Digital's recent active investments in the field of crypto AI in a podcast. He mentioned that Delphi has made about 17 crypto AI-related investments and released as many as 15 podcasts on this topic. This shows Delphi's emphasis and foresight in this field.
Initial skepticism and in-depth research on AI
Anil recalled his initial skepticism about AI, thinking it was just a buzzword that would not necessarily lead to actual products. However, as team members gained a deeper understanding of the field, he gradually built up his confidence. In particular, some members of the team, such as Tommy, Kane, and Ross, helped him see the potential of combining encryption with AI.
The intersection of encryption and AI
Anil believes that the construction of crypto infrastructure is not only to attract users, but also to attract AI agents and robots. He pointed out that AI requires an open environment and multiple interfaces to interact with various protocols, and the decentralized nature of the crypto field just meets this need. He believes that the combination of AI and crypto will provide huge opportunities for future innovation.
Teamwork and diverse perspectives
Anil emphasized that Delphi’s success lies in the collaboration and communication within the team. The close connection between their three departments of research, investment and laboratory enables experts in different fields to share views and form more comprehensive decisions. This teamwork approach enables Delphi to stay ahead in a rapidly changing market.
Delphi Day Incident
Anil Lulla described the unique activity of Delphi Day, an internal event they hold once a quarter, where team members are asked not to say anything nice about Delphi but to speak freely about the shortcomings of the company and areas for improvement.
Anil believes that this approach promotes open communication within the team and gives everyone the opportunity to express their opinions.
Form and purpose of the activity
During the Delphi Day, the team discusses the performance of each department, including research, investment, and incubation. Anil explained that usually, everyone will reflect on their own department and put forward suggestions for improvement. This open discussion atmosphere helps team members realize their own shortcomings and find opportunities for improvement.
Specific examples
Anil shared a specific example about the gaming portfolio. At the Delphi Day event at the end of last year, the team discussed their investments in the gaming sector. Although they remain optimistic about the gaming industry, they realize that a lot of investments have been made, so they need to re-evaluate whether to continue to increase investment. During the discussion, the team invited some project leaders in the gaming portfolio to show them the work being done and the problems being solved. This interaction allowed Anil to change from initial pessimism to optimism and strengthened his confidence in gaming investment.
Self-criticism and culture
Anil emphasized that Delphi values a culture of self-criticism, and the team hopes to continuously improve in this way. They are willing to accept criticism from the outside world, but they hope to find problems and make improvements on their own. This self-reflective attitude has become an important part of Delphi's culture, allowing it to stay ahead in the highly competitive encryption market.
Project launch issues: How Legion solves them
Current Market Challenges
Sushil mentioned that in the past six months, many new projects have had difficulty maintaining their listing prices, and even some reputable projects have faced challenges. New projects are often confused about how to effectively conduct initial coin offerings (ICOs), initial decentralized offerings (IDOs), and other strategies when they go public, and have not yet found an ideal solution.
Anil believes that Delphi is working hard to address these issues, especially through their new project Legion.
Legion's innovative solutions
Anil introduced Legion, a new project that just came out of stealth to solve the difficulties that new projects face when going public. The core concept of Legion is to start from the bottom up and build a scoring and resume system for investors so that non-accredited investors can also participate in investment. Although there are more legal challenges in the United States, this model is possible in Europe.
Reintroducing the ICO model
One of the highlights of Legion is that it enables projects to be distributed in a wider way and attract a different investor base, not just large venture capital firms. Anil believes that this approach can help projects go to market better and avoid the value asymmetry that may exist in traditional financing methods.
Synergies with Metallex
Anil also mentioned that Legion’s sister company Metallex is a company that focuses on blockchain legal services. Gabriel Shapiro, the founder of Metallex, was a legal advisor at Delphi and now leads this project. Metallex will provide legal support for many projects, including on-chain governance, data partnerships, protocols, and more. By working with Delphi’s lab team, Metallex will automate these legal services and integrate them into Legion, thereby enhancing its capabilities.
Future Outlook
Anil is confident about the future of Legion and believes that Legion will become the best project launch platform over time. Although it can be regarded as a launch platform at present, its functions will continue to expand and eventually provide more comprehensive support for projects. The launch of Legion is seen as an important step in solving current market challenges, and we look forward to its development and impact in the coming months.
The Evolving Crypto Cycle: Meme Coins, Solana, and Real-World Use Cases
Evolution of market cycles
Sushil mentioned that with the launch of Ethereum, the cryptocurrency market has evolved through multiple cycles. In the first cycle, all tokens were rising, and in the second cycle, those tokens with stories and visions performed well. In the current cycle, investors are beginning to distinguish between well-performing projects and poorly performing projects, paying more attention to actual performance rather than empty dreams.
Anil sees this as a sign of market maturity, but also raises the question of how to navigate such an environment and Delphi’s role in it.
Anil's view on the market
Anil reframed the concept of market cycles, believing that the second cycle was mainly the rise of DeFi, which brought real revenue models and business models. Subsequently, the craze for games, metaverses, and NFTs also brought vitality to the market. He pointed out that the importance of NFTs lies in the fact that they introduced culture into the crypto world, although the current market enthusiasm for NFTs has waned.
Current Market Dynamics
In the current cycle, Anil observed two main trends: the rise of Solana and the popularity of meme coins. Solana, as a highly liquid project, has attracted a lot of attention from investors and has a lot of room for growth even when it is below $10. On the other hand, meme coins are seen as a leveraged tool with no liquidation risk, and many investors purchase meme coins to obtain higher risk returns.
The impact of meme coins
Despite the huge amount of attention that meme coins have received in the market, Anil noted that investors within Delphi generally have a lower percentage of meme coins, averaging between 10% and 15%. This suggests that even amid the meme coin craze, investors’ confidence in their long-term potential is not as strong as in projects like Solana.
Anil believes that this phenomenon reflects the complexity and diversity of the market.
Future Outlook
Anil is optimistic about the future, especially for some important projects such as Celestia and Athena. He believes that these projects are important in the market and may be launched at the right time, bringing unexpected surprises. He emphasized that as a fundamental investor, he always believes in the importance of fundamentals and believes that the maturity of the market will continue to improve over time.
Low throughput high FDV dilemma
Jagdish brought up an important topic in the current crypto market, which is the problem of low circulation and high FDV (fully diluted market capitalization). He observed that large institutions are investing in ETFs such as Bitcoin and Ethereum, while venture capital (VC) tends to be infrastructure and basic projects. However, ordinary investors seem to be losing interest in VC tokens and turning to meme coins.
Views on VCs
Anil pointed out that many people are critical of VCs, but he believes that the performance of the market reflects the behavior of investors. He emphasized that many VCs are not guiding the market on how to launch tokens, but hope to get returns on their investments. He believes that the control of prices by market makers and exchanges may be the root cause of the problem.
The Problem of High FDV at Low Flow
Anil pointed out that the phenomenon of low circulation and high FDV is indeed a hot topic. He believes that the ideal situation is high circulation and high FDV, but currently many projects will create too much hype when they are launched, resulting in unreasonable valuations and ultimately causing price drops, which is harmful to the morale of the community and the team. Therefore, he suggested that projects need to try different issuance methods.
Effective release strategy
Anil mentioned that he joked with some clients that the best token launch could be a "bad" launch. He believes that launching a token without hype and allowing the community to build from the ground up will be more beneficial in the long run. He used Synthetix and Chainlink as examples to show that community members who entered early at low prices will remain loyal to the project because their investment has been well rewarded.
Community Changes
He also mentioned that the current community is often "mercenary-like", and investors are not very loyal to the project. Once they encounter problems, they will turn to other projects. Anil believes that the project needs to attract more users who are willing to hold for the long term to reduce this short-term behavior.
Future Directions
Finally, Anil said that the market will gradually adjust itself, especially when investors are dissatisfied with projects with low circulation and high FDV, projects will have to try new issuance models, such as Legion and Echo. In general, despite the current challenges, the relationship between projects and investors will improve as the market matures.
VC exits too early? The pros and cons of crypto investing
Jagdish raised a question about early exits by venture capital (VC) in the crypto space. He argued that this phenomenon has its benefits as VCs are able to exit before product-market fit (PMF), thereby attracting more investors to the market. However, such early exits also lead to high float and low FDV. He expressed confusion about the nature of this phenomenon, wondering if it is a feature or a bug.
Anil's opinion
Anil said that this is a good question. He believes that everything has its pros and cons. In the crypto market, early exit is seen as a feature, which is one of the reasons why many people flock to the crypto market. Investors like to be able to achieve liquidity quickly and can find some ideas that other investors may not fund.
Incentives for teams and investors
However, Anil also pointed out that when investors and teams receive generous returns before the product has found PMF, they may not be motivated to drive the product to success. Therefore, he suggested that the team can be incentivized by extending the lock-up period of the investment or setting milestones. This is crucial to keep the team motivated because investors expect the project to stick to its investment thesis. If the investment thesis changes, then early liquidity may become an issue.
Bull or bear? Why I'm more bullish on the market than ever before
Sushil brought up a hot topic about the current market, i.e., are we in a bull or bear market now. He mentioned that many people are confused about the current “boring range” and asked Anil’s opinion on this and when will the bull market start.
Anil's opinion
Anil said that he is personally very optimistic about the current market, and this is the most optimistic period since he entered the crypto field. He believes that not only the market and macro structure are changing, but also the regulatory structure of the crypto industry is undergoing positive changes. He mentioned that the long-awaited ETF (Exchange Traded Fund) is coming soon, and interest rates may soon fall, which provides positive signals for the market.
Political factors
Anil also mentioned the upcoming elections and the candidates’ attitudes towards cryptocurrencies. He believes that changes in the political environment could have a significant impact on the crypto market. For example, Trump and other candidates’ friendly attitudes towards cryptocurrencies could attract more supporters. He mentioned that Trump even mentioned including Bitcoin in fiscal reserves, which was rarely discussed in the past.
The power of community
Anil believes that the growing number of cryptocurrency holders among voters makes it impossible for politicians to ignore this group. He pointed out that people who hold cryptocurrencies tend to become single-issue voters, which makes it necessary for politicians to consider this factor when formulating policies.
Future Outlook
Overall, Anil is optimistic about the future. He believes that if good regulatory policies are introduced, it will bring new growth opportunities to the crypto market. He hopes to see politicians deliver on their promises instead of turning their attention away from cryptocurrency issues after being elected. Although he admits that he does not have a high level of trust in politics, he believes that the current political environment provides a favorable backdrop for the crypto market.
How Delphi's Three-Armed Strategy Creates Alpha
The uniqueness of the Delphi study
Jagdish mentioned that the uniqueness of Delphi research is that they not only provide research reports, but also have "skin in the game" in investing - that is, members of the research team also participate in investing, which makes their research more practical and actionable.
Anil believes that this approach makes the research more reliable because researchers are not just writing reports, they are also looking for opportunities that can bring alpha to their own portfolios.
Research and investment collaboration
Anil explained how the research and investment teams at Delphi work together. The investment team receives a large number of investment opportunities, while the research team is constantly looking for projects that are worth writing reports on. If the research team finds potential alpha, they write a report and send it to the investment team, suggesting further investigation.
Investment decision process
At Delphi, the investment decision-making process is relatively slow, usually taking two weeks. In the first week, the investment team will present investment opportunities to the Investment Committee (IC) and answer questions from committee members. In the second week, experts from the research team will participate in the discussion and conduct in-depth analysis and debate on investment opportunities. This interaction can generate high-quality discussions and help the team make more informed investment decisions.
Advantages and Challenges
Anil emphasized that although Delphi’s investment process is relatively slow, this thoughtful approach can avoid hasty decisions made due to market enthusiasm in a bull market. He believes that this approach not only improves the success rate of investment, but also promotes knowledge sharing among teams and improves the quality of research.
Delphi's three-arm strategy combines research, investment, and team collaboration to create an effective process that helps them find Alpha in the competitive crypto market. This model not only enhances the practicality of research, but also improves the quality of investment decisions, ensuring that the team can stay ahead in a complex market environment.
Noteworthy projects
Current projects of interest
Talking about current projects, Anil mentioned that he is excited about some of the emerging projects in Delphi Labs and Ventures. He noted that although he has spent less time in the Labs department, he is very bullish on two of the incubated projects - Legion and MetalX.
Labs department operating model
Anil explained how Labs works: they come up with ideas, find teams to incubate them, and then launch them to the market. Recently, they decided to temporarily stop incubating new projects and focus on advancing existing projects, and plan to evaluate them in the next nine to twelve months.
Ventures investment direction
In the Ventures department, Anil mentioned that they are looking at multiple areas, especially the intersection of AI and cryptocurrency. He mentioned some specific projects such as MyShell (a character AI-like project) and Inference Labs, which have generated a lot of interest within the team. In addition, they have invested in Haitopia, a decentralized Minecraft project, and Internet Game, which is developing at a large scale on Solana.
Infrastructure Projects
On the infrastructure side, Anil mentioned some projects worth paying attention to, such as Nisha, which is a more interconnected Rollup ecosystem with a very strong team.
Research and Consulting
In terms of research and consulting, Anil mentioned that they work with multiple protocols (such as Anoma) and will make most of their work public for everyone to learn and reference. He specifically mentioned a recent in-depth report for Optimism, sharing their views on Optimism's super chain vision.
Work and life in crypto
Maintaining a work-life balance
When asked how to maintain a balance between family life and work life in the crypto industry, Anil shared his views. He believes that although the crypto market is a 24/7 open environment, it is still very important to maintain a balance in life. He mentioned that he has made a lot of friends in this industry, and even at the moment he is attending a friend's engagement party in Spain, the discussions with friends rarely involve crypto topics, which makes him feel relaxed.
The importance of enjoying life
Anil stressed that life is short and should be enjoyed. He and his wife travel together and try to spend time with family and friends. He mentioned that the market will always exist, so people should take the initiative to seize opportunities and enjoy life. He recalled that during the first three years of founding Delphi, he had almost no rest. Although it was a very productive period, it was not healthy. After a period of reflection, he realized that proper rest can improve work efficiency.
Interesting things in the crypto industry
Talking about interesting things in the crypto industry, Anil shared his experience of quitting his job with a former colleague to start a business. He and his partner Yan decided to quit their executive positions on Wall Street and start their own crypto research company. When they explained this decision to their boss, she initially thought they were joking and expressed confusion about their choice.
Anil recalled that they also thought they resigned themselves at the bottom of the market when the price of Bitcoin fell from $20,000 to $6,000.
Motivation and determination
When they were leaving the office, their boss said to them: "If this thing doesn't work out, you can always call me. Deutsche Bank will always welcome you back." This sentence inspired Anil and Yan. They secretly made up their minds to work hard and not give themselves the opportunity to go back. Anil believes that this encouragement has made them more determined to start a business.